Date: 12 Apr 93 17:49:08 GMT From: bobm@anasazi.com (Bob Maccione) Message-ID: <1993Apr12.174908.8298@anasazi.com> Organization: Anasazi, Inc. Phoenix, Arizona USA Subject: Re: KNOTS? Kinda Long (Todd Blakaitis) writes: > >Which brings me to the subject...KNOTS! When a line brakes and you don't >have anymore available...what is the best way to deal with a break in the >center of the line? What knot causes the least stress in the line? > >I tried two things, both of which worked alright, but there is usually a better >way of doing things than my guesses. First I tied a bowline know on the >end of each string and looped one through the other. Then next time I had >a cut in the line I tied one bowline knot and than a fishing knot (don't >know the name) onto the bowline. > I just asked this question a couple of weeks ago and here are some of the replys: bob maccione ----------- 130 lines follow ------------- From: syrinx.umd.edu!jeffy@enuucp.UUCP (Jeffrey C. Burka) Subject: Re: Knots Marty has already suggested splicing if you're using kevlar. I would suggest splicing for spectra, though it's almost impossible with lines < 150#. Splicing is a rather nifty trick that takes advantage of the fact that your lines have a hollow braid. It's done with a tool that looks like a miniature latch hook, usually referred to as a 'fid'. Short ones are fairly common (I believe you can find them at sewing stores). High Fly also used to sell them, and you might be able to find one at another kite store. Premier Kites has just started making sleevers and fids out of surgical steel, about 1' long, These are probably the best such tools currently on the market. They blow away any other sleever/splicer you've used. In any event, the basic technique is: insert the fid in through the side of one piece of line an inch or two from the end, and guide the end of it out through the cut end of line I. Use the fid to pull the end of line II through the core of I and out through the side. At this point, the end of one cut line disappears into the center of the other cut line, and then exits through the side. Now reverse the procedure--insert the fid into the side of line II (at a spot an inch or so before it enters line I, and then bring the fid _back_ out the side, right at the spot where II enters I. Use the fid to pull the loose end of I into the core of II and then back out the side. Smooth out the splice and then trim the loose ends of line where the exit from the sides. And that's it! The beauty of this splice is that the harder your kite is pulling, the tighter the braid becomes, and the tighter the spliced section grips itself. I've got a set of 150# spectra that I spliced just under 3 years ago; I've flown a Tracer in 20mph winds on it, with nary a problem. And as you might expect, the splice is very smooth once the loose ends are trimmed, so you don't have to worry much about your lines sliding through each other when twisted. As should be obvious, this is almost impossible to do with smaller diameter lines simply because you can't get the fid to slide through the core. Particularly if the line is already a bit old and stretched (with a tightened braid). Jeff -- From: dstrike.demon.co.uk!dadams@enuucp.UUCP (David Adams) Subject: Re: Knots Sleeve the line with a thicked braid, it is a fiddly job but eased if you have a tool to do it, or a 12inch piece of fuse wire which you can stuff down the sleeve and pull the line through with - then the knot won't slip. Or were you asking for a knot that won't slip, knowing about and not wanting to, sleeve the line? -- David Adams From: das.harvard.edu!sasaki@enuucp.UUCP (Marty Sasaki) Subject: Re: Knots If your flying line is Kevlar, the only way of rejoining without serious loss of strength is to splice the pieces together. Dacron line can be tied together using a blood knot, or a barrel knot. Spectra is tough to tie because it is slick. You might try a blood knot or a double uni-knot. The uni-knot is a fishing knot. A good book on fishing knots is "Practical Fishing Knots" by Lefty Kreh and Mark Sosin. Sorry, I don't remember the publisher... -- Marty Sasaki Harvard University Sasaki Kite Fabrications From: crash.cts.com!danr@enuucp.UUCP (Dan Rubesh) Subject: Re: Knots I'm unclear as to what type of lines you're using, but if it's Spectra there's no knot that I've found as yet that will successfully join 2 pieces of Spectra without slipping. Probably your best bet would be to cut the other line to the same length and make a short set of whats left. The type of line, what length it was to start, and about where it broke would be helpful information.. Good Winds and Tight Lines! Dan Rubesh Wind Wizard, Purveyor of UUCP: {ucsd, nosc}!crash!danr Stunt Kites & Accessories From: VIC BLACKWELL Subject: Re: Knots I have a book full of knots for kites. What is your line make of? It makes a differance. Regards, Vic From: Felix Yen Subject: Re: Knots if you don't get a satisfactory response in the next week or so, try looking for _the Ashley book of knots_ by Clifford Ashley in your public library. this book contains instructions for hundreds of knots. in fact, Ashley even built a crude apparatus for testing knots while researching a problem similar to yours. i own the book, but it's difficult to transmit tying instructions via ASCII. if push comes to shove, i can xerox a page or two and mail/fax the diagrams to you. meanwhile, good luck. Felix yen@stsci.edu (internet) = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =