Date: Tue, 27 Apr 1993 13:01:11 GMT From: it1jk@de-montfort.ac.uk (Groove Patrol Station 3) Message-Id: <15056.9304271301@tlaloc.cms.dmu.ac.uk> Organization: Division of Applied Sciences, Harvard University Subject: BUBBLES! > > > > > > > This is posted with the hope that those that enjoy kites are the > > very same as those who enjoy the art of bubble-blowing! Both, in my > > opinion are equally good for the soul! > > > > Anyway, I'm interested in starting a rec.bubble group and don't > > know how to go about it (in fact this is my first posting) or if the > > interest is there! > > > > Any responses? > > > > Yeah - I agree, I like bubbles too! But, I don't think there's an awful lot to > write about bubbles, is there? > > = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1993 15:58:19 GMT From: era_pul@ki.ericsson.se (Peter Ulfheden ) Message-Id: Organization: Ericsson Radio Systems AB, Sweden Subject: Re: BUBBLES! I've been thinking about entertaining my kids (and myself ;-) by making a wind powered bubble maker that could be raised with a kite. Anybody seen something like that? Peter -- []-------------------------------------------------[] | Peter Ulfheden | era_pul@ki.ericsson.se | | Amorinav. 3 | or petulf@saaf.se | | S-191 44 Sollentuna | Phone: +46 8 751 02 15 | | SWEDEN | Fax: +46 8 35 04 29 | []-------------------------------------------------[] = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: 28 Apr 1993 07:06:33 GMT From: abernste@cfa200.harvard.edu (BERNSTEIN) Message-Id: <1rladpINNq9v@dns1.NMSU.Edu> Organization: New Mexico State University Subject: BUBBLES! > > This is posted with the hope that those that enjoy kites are the > > very same as those who enjoy the art of bubble-blowing! Both, in my > > opinion are equally good for the soul! > > > > Anyway, I'm interested in starting a rec.bubble group and don't > > know how to go about it (in fact this is my first posting) or if the > > interest is there! > > > > Any responses? > > > > Yeah - I agree, I like bubbles too! But, I don't think there's an awful lot to > write about bubbles, is there? Ah, but there is! Bubbles have a lot of physics associated with them! Did you know they join in only 2 ways? They can be used to find the most efficient pathways between sets of points (would this be important in neural nets?). There are all types of tricks and variations. There are books and recipes and stores completely devoted to bubbles. Check out "The Incredible Bubble Book." It outlines the history of the study of bubbles... why, even the universe has been modelled on the concept of "foam!" I don't know A LOT, and I was kinda wondering what others knew. I chose rec.kites as my initial posting group because I thought a lot of folks who read this must like pretty flying things... Aaron Bernstein P.S.: Any suggestions on other groups that would be interested, or should I just shut up and figure out how to make my own? = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1993 15:21:24 GMT From: e_splett@kaorsc.enet.dec.com (Evan Splett - Ottawa) Message-Id: <1993Apr28.142543.19052@e2big.mko.dec.com> Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation Subject: Re: BUBBLES! In article <1rladpINNq9v@dns1.NMSU.Edu>, abernste@spock (BERNSTEIN) writes... I use a large bubble maker at the beach in the Summer, particularily when there is not enough wind for kites. ( and I think Into The Wind should stop advertising the NBK as an Ultralight, it isn't ) What proportions do you use for the soap mixture ? Evan. = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1993 20:10:57 GMT From: sasaki@das.harvard.edu (Marty Sasaki) Message-Id: <1993Apr28.201057.1225@das.harvard.edu> Organization: Harvard University Subject: Re: BUBBLES! You will sometimes see a bubble machine (electric) quietly making bubbles on the kite field. When the wind is very light, it is sometimes hard to tell which way it is blowing, but the bubbles move in the right direction! -- Marty Sasaki Harvard University Sasaki Kite Fabrications sasaki@noc.harvard.edu Network Operations Division 26 Green Street 617-496-4320 10 Ware Street Jamaica Plain, MA 02130 Cambridge, MA 02138-4002 phone/fax: 617-522-8546 = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: 28 Apr 93 20:20:34 GMT From: irving@sys.toronto.edu (Irving Reid) Message-Id: <1993Apr28.162034.29729@jarvis.csri.toronto.edu> Subject: Re: BUBBLES! era_pul@ki.ericsson.se (Peter Ulfheden ) writes: >I've been thinking about entertaining my kids (and myself ;-) by making >a wind powered bubble maker that could be raised with a kite. >Anybody seen something like that? >Peter I have a Pustefix "Wirbelfix", which is a plastic airplane-shaped bubble machine which uses the propeller on the front to turn bubble wands through a trough full of bubble mix. I had to make a little frame for it in order to hang it from my line and keep it pointing into the wind. It's very eye-catching; you get a long "tail" of bubbles streaming from your kite line. Guaranteed to please all but the toughest crowds. The hardest part in designing something similar would be to keep it pointing into the wind, and to keep it from tipping and pouring bubble mixture onto innocent bystanders. - irving - = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: 28 Apr 1993 21:10:45 GMT From: abernste@cfa200.harvard.edu (BERNSTEIN) Message-Id: <1rmrslINNdbg@dns1.NMSU.Edu> Organization: New Mexico State University Subject: Re: Bubbles! > I've been thinking about entertaining my kids (and myself ;-) by making > a wind powered bubble maker that could be raised with a kite. You know, one of the interesting things about posting to this group about bubbles is the logical extension that a bubble-maker could be suspended by a kite! This is obvious due to the fact that Peter is not the first to suggest this! I am working on the idea... and it seems like it should be easy enough. It basically involves cutting a small hole in the bottom of a bottle of solution, and allowing a piece of fabric to disperse it over a bubble-frame exposed to the wind. A higher than usual water content would be necessary to counter evaporation on the solution's way down, methinks. Haven't tried it! I wish I could answer Evan's question, but I make bubbles in really large batches, once in a long while, according to a recipe in "The Unbelievable Bubble Book." The book is available in many bookstores along with the "Bubble Thing", a really large bubble-making device, published by Klutz Press. So, I'll post more on solutions later. I do remember that Dawn and Joy are supposedly the only two truly splended soaps. = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: Thu, 29 Apr 93 08:55:06 GMT From: cdt@zoo.bt.co.uk (Clive Dennett-Thorpe) Message-Id: <1993Apr29.085506.26118@zoo.bt.co.uk> Organization: BT Laboratories Subject: Re: BUBBLES! OK - I know that there were books published on Bubbles and their physics a long time ago because I remember seeing them in the school science library. I think the particular book I read dated back to 1936 - I guess surface-tension fanatics can have a field-day in this area!! I thought it was very interesting but I think I was discouraged from actually trying the stuff because of the toy bubble solutions that I'd tried from the local shops which were pretty useless. I think that you probably had to mix either some strange soaps/chemicals together to make proper solutions and again apathy defeated enthusiasm! I bought my nephew one of those incredibly large bubble-producing wands and was amazed to see 2-3 foot bubbles floating through the air.... I've seen variety artists who joined bubbles and filled them with smoke to better illustrate what they were doing...... Other famous bubbles:- 1) South Sea bubble 2) "I'm forever blowing bubbles" 3) "Bubbles" - the Pears soap advert 4) Bubbles - the late society hostess 5) Bubbles which cause divers "bends" Seriously though I'll try to find to find a copy of that book-sounds interesting. As you say anything that flies and is pretty must be worth checking out!! Clive Dennett-Thorpe "......Wow,Mum.............Look at those bubbles!!!!!!!!!!!!.........." = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1993 15:43:13 GMT From: reich@cod.nosc.mil (Ronald S. Reich) Message-Id: <9304291543.AA22626@cod.nosc.mil> Organization: Division of Applied Sciences, Harvard University Subject: Re:: Bubbles! Date: 28 Apr 1993 21:10:45 GMT From: abernste@cfa200.harvard.edu (BERNSTEIN) Subject: Re: Bubbles! Put a hook on a leading edge tip of your revolution kite and then place a shallow pan of bubble solution on the field with a ring of membrane holes into it. The ring should have a hoop sticking up that you can snag with the hook on the kite. Then as you lift the membrane ring out of the pan bubbles will be created. When you get real good you can re-dip the ring and create more bubbles. This is a great crowd pleaser and was introduce by David Brittan. Still Learning and Sharing Ron Reich = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1993 15:51:34 GMT From: daleri@saturn.wwc.edu (Richard Daley) Message-Id: Organization: Walla Walla College Subject: Re: BUBBLES! In article <1993Apr29.085506.26118@zoo.bt.co.uk> cdt@zoo.bt.co.uk (Clive Dennett-Thorpe) writes: >From: cdt@zoo.bt.co.uk (Clive Dennett-Thorpe) >Subject: Re: BUBBLES! >Date: Thu, 29 Apr 93 08:55:06 GMT >OK - I know that there were books published on Bubbles and their physics >a long time ago because I remember seeing them in the school science >library. I think the particular book I read dated back to 1936 - I > Stuff Deleted > >Seriously though I'll try to find to find a copy of that book-sounds >interesting. > The book was by C.V. Boys and was reprinted by Dover Press. Any library likely will have a copy. Good book. I have a formula for a long lasting soap bubble. In a protected environment, the bubbles last for months!!!!! Will search my files and post the formula when I find it. Richard Daley Department of Chemistry Walla Walla College Daleri@wwc.edu = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1993 16:06:11 GMT From: era_pul@ki.ericsson.se (Peter Ulfheden ) Message-Id: Organization: Ericsson Radio Systems AB, Sweden Subject: Re: Bubbles! My *IDEA* of a bubble maker on a kite looks like this. Note that I haven't tried it yet. I assume that the viscosity(sp?) of the water will keep the speed down on the rotors. Shaft v Top O--+--O <-- PingPong ball rotor view | +------------+ | | | | o-+-o <--|--- Four bubble frames on sticks | | |<-- Tank +------------+ | O--+--O <-- PingPong ball rotor Side ) ) view \ / +-----X------+ Bubble frames not shown |~~~~/~\~~~~~| \ ( ( / --------- The tank must be suspended in such way that it's aimed in the direction of the wind. A way to do this is to it the way cameras are suspended. _________ Kite /\__\__\__\ \/__/__/__/ . . . . knob--> o/ The kite line should be turned ./<-- stick a couple of turns (I don't know ./ the English name of the knot) ./P <-- hinge around each knob ./ | o o/ | o o o o . | o o o o o o . / \ o o o o o o o o . +---+ o o o o o | | <-- Tank o o +---+ Ahhh... I couldn't resist making all those bubbles ;-) Tight Line(s) Peter -- []-------------------------------------------------[] | Peter Ulfheden | era_pul@ki.ericsson.se | | Amorinav. 3 | or petulf@saaf.se | | S-191 44 Sollentuna | Phone: +46 8 751 02 15 | | SWEDEN | Fax: +46 8 35 04 29 | []-------------------------------------------------[] = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: 29 Apr 1993 20:04:28 GMT From: abernste@cfa200.harvard.edu (BERNSTEIN) Message-Id: <1rpcccINN7nh@dns1.NMSU.Edu> Organization: New Mexico State University Subject: Re: BUBBLES I think Peter's idea is a great one! :-) A lid should be constructed so that the bubble "frames" can go in and out, but that slosh is negligable. It's good, because if it's made right, it will make bubbles until the bubble solution is very low. I was not familiar with the knob-stick hookup arrangement. Very cool! As for lousy purchased bubble solutions (as mentioned by Clive), I found that the various dime-store solutions certainly vary in quality. Different solutions respond differently to different atmospheric humidity levels (vital factor!). The rule is, more water for drier days. And don't worry, about the only extra bubble ingredient besides soap (Dawn or Ivory) and water that I know of is glycerin. I think a review of various soap-bubble solutions are in order, and a recipe book of sorts! And also a rec.bubbles group, but I'm still bogged down with studying for finals to pursue this right now! Aaron Bernstein -- No bubble too big. :-) = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: 1 May 93 07:15:36 +1200 From: Colin_Douthwaite@equinox.gen.nz (Colin Douthwaite) Message-Id: Organization: Equinox Networks Subject: Re: Bubbles! Peter Ulfheden (era_pul@ki.ericsson.se) wrote: > My *IDEA* of a bubble maker on a kite looks like this. Note that > I haven't tried it yet. I assume that the viscosity(sp?) of the > water will keep the speed down on the rotors. Peter Ulfheden's design for a Flying Bubble Generator is admirable. It has yet to be manufactured and tested. A much simpler mechanism may be available. Many years ago you could buy very lightweight tin birdwarblers. They looked like tiny watering cans. You put water in the can and blew down the spout and out came a delightful bird trill or warble. This device, part filled with bubble liquid ( or detergent ), could be taped to the base of the spine of a simple single-line stable kite. The spout would be positioned to point into the wind. An assistant would be needed to carefully and gently launch the kite to avoid spillage. I feel sure that the resulting audio-visual bubbles would be a delight for other fliers and spectators. When the liquid ran out the steady whistle from this device would continue to entertain for hours. Different warblers would also produce a variety of sounds. perhaps even music ? The Birdwarbler could become a standard kite accessory. After all the Chinese put clackers, whirrers, flappers and bangers in their dragon kites. So why not bubble blowing bird warblers ? Colin Douthwaite New Zealand 1/5/93 = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: 1 May 93 11:31:15 +1200 From: Colin_Douthwaite@equinox.gen.nz (Colin Douthwaite) Message-Id: Organization: Equinox Networks Subject: Re: BUBBLES! Clive Dennett-Thorpe (cdt@zoo.bt.co.uk) wrote: > Other famous bubbles:- > 1) South Sea bubble > 2) "I'm forever blowing bubbles" > 3) "Bubbles" - the Pears soap advert > 4) Bubbles - the late society hostess > 5) Bubbles which cause divers "bends" 6) Bubble Gum >>> "......Wow,Mum........Look at those bubbles!!!!!!!!!!!!......." <<< = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: Fri, 30 Apr 1993 19:09:13 GMT From: Roger Wiegand Message-Id: <1993Apr30.190913.22548@tin.monsanto.com> Organization: Monsanto Corporate Research Subject: Re: BUBBLES! In article <1993Apr29.085506.26118@zoo.bt.co.uk> Clive Dennett-Thorpe, cdt@zoo.bt.co.uk writes: >I thought it was very interesting but I think I was discouraged from >actually trying the stuff because of the toy bubble solutions that >I'd tried from the local shops which were pretty useless. I think >that you probably had to mix either some strange soaps/chemicals >together to make proper solutions and again apathy defeated enthusiasm! You can mke a pretty good bubble mix using Dawn dishwashing soap, water, and glycerol--about a 2:1 ratio of water to detergent with about 5 glycerol added. I don't know how long the bubbles might last--the kids pop them way too soon 8-), but 4-5 ft diameters are readily achieved. Roger Wiegand rcwieg@ccmail.monsanto.com ***************** Monsanto Corp. Research, Mol. Biol. * Ignotum per * 700 Chesterfield Parkway North * ignotius * Chesterfield, MO 63198 ***************** = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: Sun, 28 Aug 1994 11:13:55 -1000 From: Colin_Douthwaite@equinox.gen.nz (Colin Douthwaite) Message-Id: Organization: Equinox Networks Subject: Bubbles For those of you still interested in bubble makers for your kites a new crop of articles have recently surfaced: ---------------------- Postings about Bubbles ---------------------- From: rosas@irisdav.chem.vt.edu (Victor) Subject: Re: Bubbles/Related things Date: Wed, 17 Aug 1994 13:34:14 In article dangit@netcom.com (Lam Dang) writes: >I plan on doing a project/paper/modeling of the characteristics >of bubbles, such as their shapes, surface movements, how they >pop (the black spots right before), and possible other related >kinda of things. >The problem is that I'm not sure where to begin -- is there a >scientific 'name' for bubble? Does this have to do more with >physics, chemistry, or equally in both fields? Has much work >been done in this field? [Has too much work been done in this >field? :]. Where do I begin my research? >Thanks, > Jimmy Dang (jdang@goober.mbhs.edu) >-- >Lam Dang >dangit@netcom.com > I would first look at research about surface tension phenomena. After all, bubbles are due primarily to the surface tension of the liquid that generates them. Hope this helps. Victor. From: David.L.Webb@dartmouth.edu (David L. Webb) Subject: Re: Bubbles/Related things Date: 18 Aug 1994 03:27:02 GMT In article dangit@netcom.com (Lam Dang) writes: > I plan on doing a project/paper/modeling of the characteristics > of bubbles, such as their shapes, surface movements, how they > pop (the black spots right before), and possible other related > kinda of things. There are some fascinating mathematical questions arising from a study of soap bubbles. To get started, see Frank Morgan's paper in a recent issue of the American Mathematical Monthly, as well as his paper in the Mathematical Intelligencer, vol. 14, no. 3 (1992). The references in those papers will give you further direction. Good luck. Best wishes, David Webb From: ps18@cornell.edu (Peter Schwartz) Subject: Re: Bubbles/Related things Followup-To: sci.physics,sci.chem Date: Wed, 17 Aug 1994 11:30:06 -0500 In article , dangit@netcom.com (Lam Dang) wrote: > The problem is that I'm not sure where to begin You might get a copy of Boys, C. V., _Soap Bubbles: Their Colors and the Forces which Mold Them_. Dover Publications, New York, 1959. ISBN 0-486-20542-8. Peter -- From: wkc@nyquist..bellcore.com (Winston K. Chan 21614) Subject: Re: Bubbles/Related things Date: Thu, 18 Aug 1994 14:03:58 GMT A good book on soap bubbles that is written for the layman is Soap Bubbles by C. V. Boys. It was originally published around 1910, but has been republished by Dover. The ISBN number is 0-486-20542-8. I bought my copy ten years ago, so I don't know if it is still in print. It should be available in most libraries. Winston Chan From: harper@kauri.vuw.ac.nz (John Harper) Subject: Re: Bubbles/Related things Date: 19 Aug 1994 00:34:53 GMT See Physics Today Oct 1991 for the mechanics and surface chem of bubbles in beer and other liquids. For more detail see R Clift, JR Grace and ME Weber, "Bubbles, Drops and Particles", McGraw-Hill(1978). If anyone is still using my article in Adv.App.Mech.12,59-129,(1972) I shall send the errata sheet on receiving their mailing address. LaTeX didn't exist then! John Harper Mathematics Dept. Victoria University Wellington New Zealand -------------------------------------------------------------------- Has anyone yet managed to attach a towline to a bubble ? Bye, = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: Fri, 2 Sep 1994 03:53:07 -1000 From: zpmobley@trident.tec.sc.us Message-Id: <347ao3$m0v@ns.sunbelt.net> Organization: Trident Technical College Subject: Re: Bubbles In article , Colin_Douthwaite@equinox.gen.nz (Colin Douthwaite) writes: >In article dangit@netcom.com (Lam >Dang) writes: > >>I plan on doing a project/paper/modeling of the characteristics >>of bubbles, such as their shapes, surface movements, how they >>pop (the black spots right before), and possible other related >>kinda of things. > >>The problem is that I'm not sure where to begin -- is there a >>scientific 'name' for bubble? Does this have to do more with >>physics, chemistry, or equally in both fields? Has much work >>been done in this field? [Has too much work been done in this >>field? :]. Where do I begin my research? > >>Thanks, >> Jimmy Dang (jdang@goober.mbhs.edu) Well, chemistry is just area specific physics actually. The deal here is surface tension. The colors (make em in the dark and hit em with a flashlight...you'll see some amazing colors happening and they move) is due to thin film physics, and that black spot before they bust is where they are so thin that they reflect no color. That is the point where the bubble actually busts due to lack of surface tension...all of the liquid that creates surface tension flows to the bottom of the bubble, which you can watch happening, and the top of the bubble gets so thin that the tension from the bottom rips the top apart. I make large bubbles, and have actually put people inside them....bubbles are right up there with kites for me. Bubbles are also great in a strobe light, and you can use a butane cannister to inflate them and then hit em with a lighter and they poof really neat. (don't try this without parental supervision kids) Per research, are you looking for serious scientific research or just your everyday joe kinda research. Bubble technology is it's own scientific field, and there are scientists who do nothing but study bubbles/suds. I made a bubble machine once that flew from the bottom of my delta....rotating wheel (wind rotates it) passes bubble wand through a container of soap and as it comes out the bubble fly! Neat as hell when winds are right. tension and tight lines to ya. = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: Fri, 2 Sep 1994 10:50:20 -1000 From: brian@nds.com (Brian Dockter) Message-Id: <94Sep2.135032pdt.170375@rainier.nds.com> Organization: Division of Applied Sciences, Harvard University Subject: Re: Bubbles On Sep 2, 6:53am, zpmobley@trident.tec.sc.us wrote: > Subject: Re: Bubbles > > I made a bubble machine once that flew from the bottom of my delta....rotating > wheel (wind rotates it) passes bubble wand through a container of soap and as > it comes out the bubble fly! Neat as hell when winds are right. While at Long Beach, I say a cheap plastic delta designed to blow bubbles. When you wanted bubbles, you would pull on the string and release. That would cause the wands to dip into the bubble solution and come out again. It didn't seem to work very well (but it was cheap). > tension and tight lines to ya. I get enough tension at work, I don't need any more, thank you. :-) Brian -- Brian Dockter | Northwest Digital Systems UUCP: uunet!nds!brian | Voice: 206-524-0014 Internet: brian@nds.com | FAX: 206-524-3440 = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: Sat, 3 Sep 1994 22:53:26 -1000 From: Colin_Douthwaite@equinox.gen.nz (Colin Douthwaite) Message-Id: Organization: Equinox Networks Subject: Re: Bubbles Brian Dockter (brian@nds.com) wrote: : On Sep 2, 6:53am, zpmobley@trident.tec.sc.us wrote: : > Subject: Re: Bubbles : > : > I made a bubble machine once that flew from the bottom of my delta....rotating : > wheel (wind rotates it) passes bubble wand through a container of soap and as : > it comes out the bubble fly! Neat as hell when winds are right. : While at Long Beach, I saw a cheap plastic delta designed to blow : bubbles. When you wanted bubbles, you would pull on the string and : release. That would cause the wands to dip into the bubble solution and : come out again. It didn't seem to work very well (but it was cheap). This posting and the earlier one from Z.P. Mobley finally convinces me that bubblemakers for kites really exist. In the discussions last year I had the strong suspicion that all this bubble-making stuff was coming from the Santa Claus Bubble Laboratory in the northern hemisphere. For those interested in bubble-ology there is a thread running in sci.physics newsgroup right now if you want to look in on it. Hmmm...I might just buy a copy of that book I saw in our local kite shop. The book comes with a giant bubble making thingy. Might be useful on days when nothing else will fly ? "The Unbelievable Bubble Book" by John Cassidy with David Stein, inventor of the Bubble Thing which has produced the Guiness Book of Records largest bubble - 250 feet long. Klutz Press, Palo Alto, California. It comes with an elaborate Giant Bubble Maker - book and bubbler for NZ$ 29.95. ( US$ 18 ). Bye, : > tension and tight lines to ya. : I get enough tension at work, I don't need any more, thank you. :-) : Brian : -- : Brian Dockter | Northwest Digital Systems : UUCP: uunet!nds!brian | Voice: 206-524-0014 : Internet: brian@nds.com | FAX: 206-524-3440 = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: Sun, 4 Sep 1994 19:36:09 -1000 From: kyteman@aol.com (Kyteman) Message-Id: <34eao9$hj0@search01.news.aol.com> Organization: America Online, Inc. (1-800-827-6364) Subject: Re: Bubbles In article , Colin_Douthwaite@equinox.gen.nz (Colin Douthwaite) writes: >I might just buy a copy of that book I saw in our local kite shop. The book comes with a giant bubble making thingy. Might be useful on days when nothing else will fly ? David Stein's Bubble Thing is splendid, and is very useful on no-wind days, but is not something that could be mounted on a kite. When I had a kite shop, I ran constant video of David blowing bubbles, because that sold more bubble things (for more day to day profit) than the stunter footage sold stunters! chin UP brooks leffler kyteman@aol.com = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: Tue, 6 Sep 1994 22:42:33 -1000 From: seanl@harlequin.co.uk (Sean Lange) Message-Id: Organization: Harlequin Ltd, Barrington Hall, Cambridge UK Subject: Re: Bubbles > I made a bubble machine once that flew from the bottom of my delta....rotating > wheel (wind rotates it) passes bubble wand through a container of soap and as > it comes out the bubble fly! Neat as hell when winds are right. I too have tried a bubble machine under a delta. It was a small toy, shaped like a plane with small trough for bubble juice and and prop that when spun caused wands to dip in and out of the juice. In good wind conditions if was great - a very impressive stream of bubbles. The one problem I had was getting the gizmo into the air without spilling half the bubble juice over me, the kite and the field. Anyone else experience this and/or have solutions. - sean = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: Tue, 6 Sep 1994 04:18:52 -1000 From: pwmeek@garnet.msen.com (Peter W. Meek) Message-Id: <34htoc$gjs$1@heifetz.msen.com> Organization: Msen, Inc. -- Ann Arbor, MI (account info: +1 313 998-4562) Subject: Re: Bubbles : >>I plan on doing a project/paper/modeling of the characteristics : >>of bubbles, such as their shapes, surface movements, how they : >>pop (the black spots right before), and possible other related : >>kinda of things. : > : >>The problem is that I'm not sure where to begin -- is there a : >>scientific 'name' for bubble? Does this have to do more with : >>physics, chemistry, or equally in both fields? Has much work : >>been done in this field? [Has too much work been done in this : >>field? :]. Where do I begin my research? : > : >>Thanks, : >> Jimmy Dang (jdang@goober.mbhs.edu) There is a classic work on this subject first published in 1902: _Soap_Bubbles_and_the_Forces_Which_Mould_Them_ by Sir Charles Vernon Boys. It has been republished as a Doubleday-Anchor book in 1959 and I believe I have seen it recently (past few years) in bookstores. You may think that this is something of an antique, but bubbles don't change much. The only major new material that you might want to search out would be whether there any computer modeling systems based on algorithms which were not available (or not practical due to the the amount of calculation required). The material in the book is easily understandable since it was taken from a series of lectures for young people. This is not to say that the material is either simple or simplistic -- hard-core physics is being presented here, but in a way that requires no advanced mathematics or physics to understand what is being presented. I recommend it to anyone interested in the subject. -- --Pete "Since at first there was no space, | Cao Xueqin ca. 1760 Things can have no proper place." | (tsao schwechin) = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: Wed, 7 Sep 1994 03:34:39 -1000 From: zpmobley@trident.tec.sc.us Message-Id: <34kfhf$gf3@ns.sunbelt.net> Organization: Trident Technical College Subject: Re: Bubbles In article , seanl@harlequin.co.uk (Sean Lange) writes: > >> I made a bubble machine once that flew from the bottom of my delta....rotating >> wheel (wind rotates it) passes bubble wand through a container of soap and as >> it comes out the bubble fly! Neat as hell when winds are right. > >I too have tried a bubble machine under a delta. It was a small toy, >shaped like a plane with small trough for bubble juice and and prop >that when spun caused wands to dip in and out of the juice. In good >wind conditions if was great - a very impressive stream of bubbles. >The one problem I had was getting the gizmo into the air without >spilling half the bubble juice over me, the kite and the field. Anyone >else experience this and/or have solutions. > >- sean I had that problem as well...I don't have the perfect solution, but if you center the prop in a deep wide bucket and only fill it a quarter full it spills less than with the prop originating outside the bucket. (I say bucket when I should say lightweight soap solution container, don't try it with a 5 gallon galvanized pail unless you have a hell of a delta!). At the top place parallel strips of saran wrap alongside, but not in the way of, the prop, and this will reduce spillage considerabley. Using a stiff tape like duct tape to keep the wrap from blowing all over and screwing up the airstream will produce better bubbles. Also, use a little extra glycerine in the solution and shoot for dry cool (cold) weather....hot dries bubbles and humid dilutes them, both shorten bubble lifespan. Make sure the wands are wide and serated to hold maximum quantity of your solution and that the prop is hindered enough to keep it from spinning crazy and throwing solution all over....Also, if you strongly illuminate downwind from the underside of the bucket the extra weight (again, don't overdue the weight or you'll be grounded) helps keep it from swinging so wildly and the light makes great colors in the bubbles at night. Crude and elementary ascii drawing follows... >From the side... _____ _____ | | | | |___| |___| \ / \ / ________________________________________________________________________ | \ / | | \ / | | \ / | | \ / | | \ / | | \ / | | O | | / \ | | / \ | | / \ | | / \ | | / \ | | / \ | | / \ | | / \ | | _____ / \_____ | | | | | | | | |___| |___| | |______________________________________________________________________| >From the top.... ________________________________________________________________________ | | | SARAN WRAP | |----------------------------------------------------------------------| | SARAN WRAP COVERED WITH TAPE | |----------------------------------------------------------------------| | PROP | | ---------------------------O------------------------------ | | | |----------------------------------------------------------------------| | SARAN WRAP COVERED WITH TAPE | |----------------------------------------------------------------------| | SARAN WRAP | |______________________________________________________________________| Happy trails Tom = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: Fri, 9 Sep 1994 10:32:56 -1000 From: Colin_Douthwaite@equinox.gen.nz (Colin Douthwaite) Message-Id: Organization: Equinox Networks Subject: Re: Bubbles Sean Lange (seanl@harlequin.co.uk) wrote: > I too have tried a bubble machine under a delta. It was a small > toy, shaped like a plane with small trough for bubble juice and > and prop that when spun caused wands to dip in and out of the juice. What sort of dimensions and weight did this gadget have ? Presumably it was made mainly of plastic with metal for the prop shaft and wands ? What did the toy cost ? Bye, = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: Fri, 9 Sep 1994 10:39:20 -1000 From: Colin_Douthwaite@equinox.gen.nz (Colin Douthwaite) Message-Id: Organization: Equinox Networks Subject: Re: Bubbles zpmobley@TRIDENT.TEC.SC.US wrote: > I had that problem as well...I don't have the perfect solution, > but if you center the prop in a deep wide bucket and only fill it > a quarter full it spills less than with the prop originating > outside the bucket. (I say bucket when I should say lightweight > soap solution container, don't try it with a 5 gallon galvanized > pail unless you have a hell of a delta!). So what size and weight of bucket are you describing and what diameter for the bubble wands ( I assume they are circular shaped at the ends to form the bubbles ) ? For interest - here is a repost of Peter Ulfheden's design for a bubblemaker - I don't think he ever built it: -------------------------------------------------------------------- Subject: Re: Bubbles! From: era_pul@ki.ericsson.se (Peter Ulfheden ) Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1993 16:06:11 GMT Organization: Ericsson Radio Systems AB, Sweden My *IDEA* of a bubble maker on a kite looks like this. Note that I haven't tried it yet. I assume that the viscosity(sp?) of the water will keep the speed down on the rotors. Shaft v Top O--+--O <-- PingPong ball rotor view | +------------+ | | | | o-+-o <--|--- Four bubble frames on sticks | | |<-- Tank +------------+ | O--+--O <-- PingPong ball rotor Side ) ) view \ / +-----X------+ Bubble frames not shown |~~~~/~\~~~~~| \ ( ( / --------- The tank must be suspended in such way that it's aimed in the direction of the wind. A way to do this is to it the way cameras are suspended. _________ Kite /\__\__\__\ \/__/__/__/ . . . . knob--> o/ The kite line should be turned ./<-- stick a couple of turns (I don't know ./ the English name of the knot) ./P <-- hinge around each knob ./ | o o/ | o o o o . | o o o o o o . / \ o o o o o o o o . +---+ o o o o o | | <-- Tank o o +---+ Ahhh... I couldn't resist making all those bubbles ;-) Tight Line(s) Peter -------------------------------------------------------------------- Bye, = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: Mon, 12 Sep 1994 05:22:30 -1000 From: zpmobley@trident.tec.sc.us Message-Id: <351rnm$6i3@ns.sunbelt.net> Organization: Trident Technical College Subject: Re: Bubbles In article , Colin_Douthwaite@equinox.gen.nz (Colin Douthwaite) writes: >zpmobley@TRIDENT.TEC.SC.US wrote: > > [bubble stuff deleted] >> I had that problem as well...I don't have the perfect solution, >So what size and weight of bucket are you describing and what >diameter for the bubble wands ( I assume they are circular shaped at >the ends to form the bubbles ) ? > I couldn't tell you the weight, but the bucket was app 12 x 12 x 6. The wands I cut off of bubble wands (app 1" diameter), and the prop was hand made. I cut off the end of a walnut dow rod for the center piece and whittled my own props >From walnut stock. It flew with the wide side to the wind and required 4 bridles to hold it in place. It would probably be better behaved with the narrow side to the wind and by using ping pong halves below the wands rather than the prop. May have more success in lighter winds also. Mine was crushed in the next to last move I made, and I think that when I remake it I will try it with the smaller sillouette to the wind and the ping pong balls. = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: Tue, 13 Sep 1994 00:21:04 -1000 From: seanl@harlequin.co.uk (Sean Lange) Message-Id: Organization: Harlequin Ltd, Barrington Hall, Cambridge UK Subject: Re: Bubbles Sean Lange (seanl@harlequin.co.uk) wrote: > I too have tried a bubble machine under a delta. It was a small > toy, shaped like a plane with small trough for bubble juice and > and prop that when spun caused wands to dip in and out of the juice. What sort of dimensions and weight did this gadget have ? Presumably it was made mainly of plastic with metal for the prop shaft and wands ? What did the toy cost ? The gadget was made of plastic, with a plastic prop and wands (3) the only metal was the shaft from prop to wands. The tank for juice was semicircular about 3in radius and about 3/4in wide (not big enough in my experience). 3 mount points, both wings and tail. Overall wingspan 9in, length 10in (all dimensions approx). Cost 5 quid. - sean = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: Sun, 11 Jun 1995 14:10:06 -1000 From: amirault@max.tiac.net (Richard Amirault) Message-Id: Organization: The Internet Access Company Subject: Bubbles! I've just finished construction of a bubble machine. A friend of mine made one. I got a copy of the plans from him and made one for myself. I don't have the plans here at home, and I can't remember the authors last name, but his first name is FELIX. (I wish I could give the proper credit) Gave the machine its first workout last weekend, and it was a rousing success. It just shot bubbles out for hour upon hour, and the kids went nuts (at least some of them) Does anyone have any further information on making bubble solution from scratch? I've been able to find commercial solution at a reasonable price, but I want to investigate making my own solution. Richard In Boston amirault@tiac.net = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: Sun, 11 Jun 1995 15:29:36 -1000 From: jburka@Glue.umd.edu (Jeffrey C. Burka) Message-Id: <3rg5a0$5ru@geog20.umd.edu> Organization: Project Glue, University of Maryland, College Park Subject: Re: Bubbles! In article , Richard Amirault wrote: >I've just finished construction of a bubble machine. A friend of mine >made one. I got a copy of the plans from him and made one for myself. I >don't have the plans here at home, and I can't remember the authors last >name, but his first name is FELIX. (I wish I could give the proper credit) That would be Felix Cartegna. He's from...Delaware, as I recall, and has been a long-time staple at mid-atlantic festivals, including Smithsonian and SunFest. His bubble machines have always been wildly popular, but as far as I know, he doesn't sell them, though a few have appeared in SunFest auctions. And yes, Felix does kites too. ;-) >Does anyone have any further information on making bubble solution from >scratch? I've been able to find commercial solution at a reasonable >price, but I want to investigate making my own solution. Felix has told me that he's tried various recipes for homemade bubble solution, but has found commercial types to be much better. He buys in bulk (I believe I've seen one gallon jugs under his rig). Jeff -- |Jeffrey C. Burka | Pithy, insightful quote to be inserted | | | when one occurs to me. *If* one occurs | |jeffy@glue.umd.edu | to me. | = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: Mon, 12 Jun 1995 07:19:29 -1000 From: jason robbins Message-Id: <3rhsv1$n7j@news.voicenet.com> Organization: Robbins 8th & Walnut Subject: Re: Bubbles! How can we get plans and more info on this bubble machine? Can you describe its construction and operation to me? Thanks, Jason = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: Mon, 12 Jun 1995 08:23:13 -1000 From: DHAXTON@SSSP.GSFC.NASA.GOV (Donovan Haxton) Message-Id: Organization: NASA Goddard Space Flight Center -- Greenbelt, Maryland USA Subject: Re: Bubbles! > > >Does anyone have any further information on making bubble solution from > >scratch? I've been able to find commercial solution at a reasonable > >price, but I want to investigate making my own solution. > > Felix has told me that he's tried various recipes for homemade bubble > solution, but has found commercial types to be much better. He buys in > bulk (I believe I've seen one gallon jugs under his rig). > > Jeff > -- > |Jeffrey C. Burka | Pithy, insightful quote to be inserted | > | | when one occurs to me. *If* one occurs | > |jeffy@glue.umd.edu | to me. | ******************** For a good bubble soap, try mixing dish washing soap (like Joy) 90with glycerin 10 by volumn. It is not the best, but works well and is easy to make. Don Haxton = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: Mon, 12 Jun 1995 10:19:48 -1000 From: andrew@tug.com (Andrew Beattie) Message-Id: Organization: /usr/lib/news/organisation Subject: Re: BUBBLES! amirault@max.tiac.net (Richard Amirault) writes: >I've just finished construction of a bubble machine. A friend of mine >made one. I got a copy of the plans from him and made one for myself. Is this ground-based or are you sending the whole thing into the air, to be driven by the wind? (that would be way cool...) If you can get permission to distrubute the plans, it would be a fun toy to publish in the archives/web. There are plenty here who would provide scanner & space... Andrew -- New to rec.kites? START HERE! | To: www@kfs.org send an email message like this->| Subject: service /-\ () >< () |\/| () >< () /-\ | http://www.kfs.org/kites/welcome/index.html note: A 1 hour local evening call costs 20more after BT's latest price-cut. = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: Tue, 13 Jun 1995 07:18:48 -1000 From: miraz@nyc.pipeline.com (Mira Zivkovich) Message-Id: <3rkh9o$oaj@pipe1.nyc.pipeline.com> Organization: The Pipeline Subject: Re: Bubbles! What is this doing on a kite newsgroup? Just wondering... = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: Tue, 13 Jun 1995 06:04:09 -1000 From: Peter Loop Message-Id: <3rkctp$j4i@ornews.intel.com> Organization: Intel Subject: Re: Bubbles! amirault@max.tiac.net (Richard Amirault) wrote: >Does anyone have any further information on making bubble solution from >scratch? I've been able to find commercial solution at a reasonable >price, but I want to investigate making my own solution. The best recipe for bubbles I have found is: Equal parts: - Dawn liquid dishwashing soup - the blue stuff. (the brand does make a difference) - Corn Syrup - Then add Water (experiment with the amount) This works very well for giant bubbles. And doesnt leave a sticky mess. Peter Loop = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: Tue, 13 Jun 1995 06:52:53 -1000 From: huet@fail.com (Roland Huet) Message-Id: Organization: Failure Analysis Associates, Inc. Subject: Re: Bubbles! In article , amirault@max.tiac.net (Richard Amirault) wrote: > Does anyone have any further information on making bubble solution from > scratch? I've been able to find commercial solution at a reasonable > price, but I want to investigate making my own solution. The usual solution recipe to make large bubbles (the kind several feet across, if you are good) is 1/3 Dawn dishwashing liquid, 2/3 water, and 1 tablespoon of glycerin per gallon of solution. Roland Huet huet@fail.com = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: Tue, 13 Jun 1995 19:27:58 -1000 From: foxon@hevanet.com (C. M. Fox) Message-Id: Organization: Hevanet Communications Subject: Re: Bubbles! I remember a bubble recipe I made for my kids requiring glycerin in it. The glycerin helps keep the surface tension on the bubbles. My kids are teenagers so I can't find the recipe. Check out the parent/kid section of a bookstore and there's bound to be a book with a recipe in it. The rest of the recipe was liquid dishwashing detergent and maybe water. Carla = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: Wed, 14 Jun 1995 08:02:37 -1000 From: coreykite@aol.com (Coreykite) Message-Id: <3rn87t$89p@newsbf02.news.aol.com> Organization: America Online, Inc. (1-800-827-6364) Subject: Re: Bubbles! >What is the discussion of bubbles doing in this newsgroup? I paraphrase... Silly rabbits... Flags and banners only show the wind right where they are. Bubble machines send a stream of bubbles down a field or beach and show where the wind goes! Besides, they are WAY COOL! aoxomoxoa coreykite@aol.com = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: Wed, 14 Jun 1995 10:34:50 -1000 From: mr.nasty@ix.netcom.com (Frank Kenisky ) Message-Id: <3rnh5a$8a3@ixnews3.ix.netcom.com> Organization: Netcom Subject: Re: Bubbles! In <3rn87t$89p@newsbf02.news.aol.com> coreykite@aol.com (Coreykite) writes: > >>What is the discussion of bubbles doing in this newsgroup? >I paraphrase... >Silly rabbits... Flags and banners only show the wind right where they >are. >Bubble machines send a stream of bubbles down a field or beach and show >where the wind goes! >Besides, they are WAY COOL! Picture this, Corey in a bunny wabbit suit standing in front of a bunch of kiters and saying this. I think this would be even more COOL!!! (As long as he's down wind, of course) -- *************>>>>>>>>>>>>>MR.NASTY<<<<<<<<<<<<<************** Fiesta Kite Ideas http://www.tmn.com/kiteweb/home.htm 8302 Tiguex Mr.Nasty@ix.netcom.com Universal City, TX 78148 (210) 659-1803 or (512) 326-6221 ************************************************************* = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: Thu, 15 Jun 1995 10:39:58 -1000 From: Michael Goldman <73164.1426@CompuServe.COM> Message-Id: <3rq5qu$rik$1@mhadg.production.compuserve.com> Organization: via CompuServe Information Service Subject: Re: Bubbles! >Does anyone have any further information on making bubble solution from >scratch? I've been able to find commercial solution at a reasonable >price, but I want to investigate making my own solution. The recipe for bubbles included in the book with the bubble wand goes something like this: 1 part Joy dishwashing liquid 10 parts water optionally, about a 1/8 part glycerin or corn syrup (makes the bubbles last longer). Larger bubbles will last longer in humid, still air (something to do when we can't fly our kites!). For dryer air, use a little more Joy. -- Michael Goldman - Clifton, VA 73164.1426@COMPUSERVE.COM member - AKA and KAK = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: Fri, 16 Jun 1995 07:52:18 -1000 From: kichiwa@eskimo.com (Mike Eason) Message-Id: Organization: Not Much! Subject: Re: Bubbles! In article <3rnh5a$8a3@ixnews3.ix.netcom.com>, mr.nasty@ix.netcom.com says... (Coreykite) >writes: >>>bubbles in this newsgroup? >>Besides, they are WAY COOL! > >Picture this, Corey in a bunny wabbit suit >(As long as he's down wind, of course) I agree with Frank! That would be great. Corey would probably be game to do it at WSIKF if someone has the suit? How about it, Corey? I thought Bubbles was that dancer we ran into at Ivanpah! Maybe Dan R. would remember for sure. Starting unfounded rumors sure is fun! :-) Mike -- Mike Eason or Media Specialist: Everett Community College, Everett, WA President: Snohomish County Incredible Flying Individuals, SCI-FI voice:206-334-0362 H. :206-388-9117 W. fax:206-388-9144 Organizer, contact for information: 3rd Annual Washington State Sport Kite Championships, Sept. 22-24, 1995 Whidbey Island Kite Festival, Ft. Casey Conf. Center, Sept. 22-24, 1995 Jetty Island Kite Festival, Everett, WA. July 9, 1995 = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: Sat, 17 Jun 1995 04:33:54 -1000 From: wastelnd@acy.digex.net Message-Id: <3rup4i$4vp@news3.digex.net> Organization: the wasteland Subject: Re: Bubbles! > Peter Loop writes: > The best recipe for bubbles I have found is: > > Equal parts: > - Dawn liquid dishwashing soup - the blue stuff. > (the brand does make a difference) > - Corn Syrup > > - Then add Water (experiment with the amount) >>>> The brand does make a difference...Dawn is fine, but I found Joy to be the best: 1 cup Joy 1 gallon water 50 drops of glycerin stay away from cheapy detergent... the wasteland http://www.acy.digex.net/~wastelnd/waste.html = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =